I refuse to add to the behemoth that is the "Discuss the Animals" thread. Even with the fancy red subject bars, I can't navigate it reasonably, because it has gotten too big. I fear that it will soon acheive sentience, at which point it will probably try to challenge zamphir for highest post count.

So here, in its very own thread, are my thoughts on pushing over sleeping bars...

Wait... no, that's not right...

Tips. Here in the midwest, I've heard conversations where one person says they tip $1 / drink, another says that seems awfully high, and the first agrees but says it results in really good service...

Now, why should $1/drink seem high? I assume they're thinking along the lines of food tips (15 to 18 percent, depending). They also tend to be drinking bottles of cheap beer. So a $1 tip might seem a little high for a $2.50 beer.

At places where I'm a regular, I tend to tip much higher than necessary. Partially this is because I can; partially because I feel a bit bad about my fellow drinkers who short the tip jar; and also partially because if I'm going to be there often enough to be recognized, I like to stay on the bar staff's good side :)

Other than that, I tend to think $1/drink (unless I'm drinking something so expensive that $1 is less than 15%) is decent. Less than that... well, I somehow just can't feel right about getting a drink and giving the server a couple coins...

Excellent point -- I've locked the ATA thread in favor of threads like this one.

As for myself and Phillip, we tend to tip about as high as we can stand to, right up to the point where it hurts. If you're a regular, it pays to keep people on your good side if they're serving you drinks.

I tend to drink at happy hours, so tipping $1 for a $1.50 rail never really sat very well. And anything more than $0.50 for the $2.50 pitcher was just wrong.

Of course, I'm no longer living in The Land of Cheap Beer, rather I'm living in Balmor, Hon. So I expect drinks will be more expensive.

Once I get settled (and stop being on vacation), I think I'm gonna see if there are enough people to have a semi-regular pub night.

Usually, I put a buck down with the first drink and then after another two or three put another buck down.

It really depends on how long they leave me standing there at the bar and also what kind of change I get. If I buy a drink with a 10 and I get 5 bucks in change, well, there's not much I can do about a tip, unless I drink so much that night that I would end up leaving 5 bucks down. Of course, if I'm drinking that much, there's probably a tab, and then I just leave a fat tip at the end of the night.

In Response to jon (#8384):

The beauty of living in a country where the bar staff get paid properly (it ain't much but it is comparable to what I have heard for wages + tips in tipping countries).

To keep a barman on side you just turn up regularly, drink a lot and avoid causing disturbances in the bar. Oh and if you do cause, or are involved in, disturbances you apologise.

Actually to be honest, when working in bars I preferred those customers over the bastards that thought that because they have tipped you well they can get away with more...

In Response to zamphir (#8385):

I tend to drink at happy hours, so tipping $1 for a $1.50 rail never really sat very well. And anything more than $0.50 for the $2.50 pitcher was just wrong.

See, for me, it seems as though bar tipping is different than restaurant tipping. You're not tipping on the cost, you're tipping on the amount of effort it takes for the poorly-compensated bartender to get you a drink. I don't think the bartender should lose out just because the drinks are cheaper. On the contrary -- there's more money in your pocket, so send more of it back to the bartender.

Anyuthing less than a dollar per drink, no matter what the cost, just seems chintzy to me. Besides, is that dollar really making a differnece in your wallet? Is the extra 50 cents you saved on the pitcher tip going to help with this month's rent?

Well, I'm one of them thar collegate drinkers still, and so strapped for cash often. When I go out drinking, I usually shoot for a group tip of $1 per hour per person when at my favorite places. It's cheaper than I'd like, but I tend not to exceed two an hour. However, I usually end up nagging the alcoholics I hang out with for the tip. They aren't cheap per se... just usually too out of it to remember service pleasantries.

When at a obvious college dungpit bar, I tend not to tip because they deal in annoying bulk, not in service.

I also go to college bars, and the ones we frequent have such busy waitstaff that we always order from the bar. Does this negate the need to tip? Am I supposed to tip the bartender then?

If the bartender makes such a horrible drink that we have to have him fix it three times do I have to tip him? This has happended. Apparently I look like I need a super strong drink.

Well, in the town where I work - there are really,really good tippers ($1 or more per drink) and there are those who tip on the "keep the coins" method (usually 50 or 75 cents), then there are the non-tippers, who won't give up a cent of their money, not even a few pennies left behind on the table, nope - they scrape it all back into their pockets. I guess I fell most irritated when I go out of the way making 3 trips because they couldn't remember how many mugs were needed, then they want tomato juice for red draws, then they needed salt, and then - oh, cold I get them some change for the pool tables....about this time they want another pitcher and I've spent 30 minutes on a friday nite with nit-wits and get no tip.

In Response to jon (#8390):

you're tipping on the amount of effort it takes for the poorly-compensated bartender to get you a drink.
Which is the same amount of effort no matter how big the size of the beer he's pouring - either a glass or a pitcher. Now, with mixed drinks, I agree with you. But again, if it's something like a whisky and soda or jack and coke, then it's about the same effort as pouring a beer.

Anyuthing less than a dollar per drink, no matter what the cost, just seems chintzy to me
I don't think I claimed not to be chintzy. Why else would I be drinking at happy hours, for god sakes? If I wanted a decently made drink that wasn't watered down, and was worthy of a decent tip, I'd be paying full price later in the evening. And drinking somewhere else.

Honestly, though, how much I tip depends a lot on what I've got in cash on me and whether I think I'm gonna be coming back to the place very often. If I'm paying by credit, I'm usually fairly generous. If I'm paying by cash, and I've got a five, and a one, and I've already left the change from each of my drinks, I'm not gonna leave the five.

In Response to tor (#8388):

That's a good point. Not being an asshole (much) at the bar is also part of my staying-on-the-barstaff's-good-side strategy. I've seen regulars come and go who thought over-tipping was sufficient, and listened to the bartenders complain about them after they'd gone.

In Response to mea37 (#8422):

Bartenders just like to complain.

In Response to michele9993 (#8406):

You should still tip the bartender even if you order at the bar. They may be better paid than the server on the floor, but they're still working for tips. That's why they have a jar. One thing to remember is that nearly all servers (and most bartenders) make less than minimum wage, plus tips.

Many bartenders think they're doing you a favor by mixing a stronger drink. Unless you ordered a rum and coke and they just gave you a shot of rum, I wouldn't consider that a major reason not to tip.

Now I am assuming that, if you're a regular and you're ordering directly from the bar, they'll eventually get in the habbit of mixing your drink less strong. Most bartenders wouldn't like re-mixing your drink any more than you like having to ask them to, and if the problem persists, you could always politely remind them to mix yours a little weaker than they normally would.

But, in that line of thinking, try to look at the situation from the bartender's perspective. He or she is probably mixing the drink the way most people like it. He or she is then putting in extra effort to re-make the drink for you the way you like it. If you do not tip, you will piss him or her off.

And then, of course, tipping is discretionary, so it's up to you what you consider worth non-tipping, but as for me, I'd pretty much have to be so pissed off that I wouldn't go back to the place.

In Response to zamphir (#8423):

In the great Venn Diagram of life, most people overlap at the 'likes to complain' locus.

As a bartender myself, and having discussed the point with other bartenders, the usual tip is $1/drink. The national average, someone once quoted me, is $1.43/drink, when one excludes those who leave no tip at all.

Of course, bartenders like myself tend to tip better than most when out at a bar ourselves. Those who make their living on tips tend to be good tippers in consequence.

In Response to zamphir (#8419):

But again, if it's something like a whisky (sic) and soda or jack and coke, then it's about the same effort as pouring a beer.

A Jack and Coke IS a whiskey and soda! </pedant>

In Response to Chad (#8480):

A Jack and Coke IS a whiskey and soda!
<pedant>Jack Daniels is bourbon, not whiskey.</pedant>

Whisky is not spelled wrong. And if you order "whiskey and soda" (no matter how you spell whisky), you will not get Coca-cola as the soda, no matter what you get for the whiskey.

In Response to zamphir (#8487):

Curse you! I thought I had you. I can clearly see "Whiskey" on the label of Jack Daniel's in my head though, but you're very right on the soda isn't coke thing. But I don't think it's a bourbon.

In Response to Chad (#8488):

In the south though, everything is coke, so you're sorta right.

In Response to Chad (#8488):

I think he was referring to the spelling of whiskey...

from memory:
Whiskey is Irish or Bourbon
Whisky is Scotch or Canadian

Which is kind of odd when you think about which ones are most similar.

In Response to Grimicus (#8489):

More to the point: In the south, everyone is wrong.

And it's not pop, either. ;)

In Response to mcgrue (#8513):

Amen, I grew up in dah 'burgh, and my god, I wanted to smack the crap out of everyone who said 'pop'. (Moved there from NJ where I learnt it right :-) ).

The funny thing was, my wife is from cleveland area, and she told me that when she came to Pittsburgh, everyone she knew said soda.

In Response to Chad (#8488):

Okay, I may be wrong about Jack being bourbon. It doesn't say bourbon on their website. I don't buy Jack, and only drink it when it's poured by someone else, and most American produced whiskey *is* bourbon, so it's not too unsurprising a mistake.

Getting back to the topic at hand, though, I've got a question.

What's the appropriate tipping procedure when you ALSO order food from the bartender? Is it the usual tipping as if the bartender was wait staff? Is it that plus $1/drink? Or something else?

I've been eating at a lot of pubs lately (including one that had both Weihenstephaner Hefe AND hand pulled Real Ale). Maybe I should Ask the Animals...

In Response to zamphir (#8517):

Okay, I may be wrong about Jack being bourbon

I thought it was too. I could have sworn the label says bourbon whiskey on it; but I can't remember the last time I had my hands on a bottle, so I might just be projecting from all those other Kentucky 'whiskeys.'

I've been eating at a lot of pubs lately

I've been doing alot of business travel lately, so I have too. I usually tip 20% or so for food service (assuming the service is good.) When I'm at the bar eating dinner, I usually do the same, if the service is equal to what I'd get at a table. If the bartender provides very good service, I'll give a dollar a drink on top of that. I'm not sure if those are official standards, but it seems logical to me. Of course, at my usual pub night, I'll give my regular bartender $10-15 tip because he usually only charges us for food.

Weihenstephaner Hefe AND hand pulled Real Ale

I didn't know such a place could exist! Where is it? I think I hear a road trip coming on...

In Response to Chad (#8488):

both 'whiskey' and 'whisky' are correct spellings. 'Whiskey' usually for American and Irish, and 'whisky' for Canadian and Scottish.

http://www.history-of-whisky.com/html/trends.html

If you are putting soda in a 'whisky', it better not have the words 'Scotland' and 'Single Malt' written on it.

For those of you cheap bastards that think $1 for a drink that costs $3 or more is too much, there are a few places where you should go to drink. 1.) Home and 2.) frat parties. The tip is simply part of the price of drinking. And yes, this tip goes whoever hands you the drink, bartender or wait staff. Where were you raised?

One of the great indicators that you are out with good people is when collection is made for a tab and there is too much money in the pot. If this has never happened to you, you are probably 1.) cheap and 2.) in need of better friends. The worst, of couse, are the early leavers that only pay the exact price of their drink and hose everybody else. Oh, and please don't forget about the tax. Tax and tip make a surcharge of at least 25% on the cost of your drinks. Trust me, if you leave early and stiff the bill, there are plenty of drunk people who curse your name, and they will remember that you are cheap when they wake up in the morning.